New York Times on the Web Forums Science

Missile Defense

Technology has always found its greatest consumer in a nation's war and defense efforts. Since the last attempts at a "Star Wars" defense system, has technology changed considerably enough to make the latest Missile Defense initiatives more successful? Can such an application of science be successful? Is a militarized space inevitable, necessary or impossible?

Read Debates, a new Web-only feature culled from Readers' Opinions, published every Thursday.

mazza9 - 10:19am Jul 25, 2002 EST (#3300 of 3327)
"Quae cum ita sunt" Caesar's Gallic Commentaries

RShowalter says:"I think it was Mazza -- anyway, it had words like "Lchic says link . . . but you stink! " The New York Times can check that what I say here, if it wishes.

Only worth remembering now because it was deleted."

Think! Don't know! How convenient that this alleged statement is deleted. Since I don't remember any such statement and you have no proof of it ever being posted since you say it was deleted how do we "connect the dots"? On your say so?

I take umbrage!

Main Entry: um·brage Pronunciation: '&m-brij Function: noun Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin umbraticum, neuter of umbraticus of shade, from umbratus, past participle of umbrare to shade, from umbra shade, shadow; akin to Lithuanian unksme shadow Date: 15th century 1 : SHADE, SHADOW 2 : shady branches : FOLIAGE 3 a : an indistinct indication : vague suggestion : HINT b : a reason for doubt : SUSPICION 4 : a feeling of pique or resentment at some often fancied slight or insult <took umbrage at the speaker's remarks> synonym see OFFENSE

LouMazza

rshowalt - 10:51am Jul 25, 2002 EST (#3301 of 3327)

Mazza, why not let's get some key things checked?

Was posting this, which I think applies to you.

The Dow Jones Average is a sum of many stocks, and news about one company effects the valuation of others. What a company does effects itself in ways that can be accounted correctly (especially if care is taken.) And what a company does also effects the whole business community, and the larger community. There are what economists call external effects . External effects aren't directly accounted - they deal with more than selfish interests - but they are very important - and perhaps that's a reason why we're so nice.

. Why We're So Nice: We're Wired to Cooperate By NATALIE ANGIER http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/23/health/psychology/23COOP.html?pagewanted=all&position=top

It makes sense to cooperate. And certain patterns are much better for the group than others. The golden rule is wired into us.

People need to think about the stability of the decisions that they make. How things done effect the people involved, directly and indirectly. Over time. In context.

Partly, that's a matter of reasonably accounting issues economists have talked about a long time -- issues of external effects. After a while, you have to deal with them, if good solutions are to be found. Lies and deceptions have large and unpredictable external effects - they poison all sorts of things. Openness, on the other hand, tends to have positive external effects -- it helps people sort things out.

The fact that our institutions are being cleaned up should be GOOD for the markets. And for the honest people in them. That is to say, for most people.

No one doubts the importance of privacy. No one doubts the imperfection of people, information, and ideas. But when it matters (when money or safety are at stake - and when the decisions of many people, with many consequences are at stake) truth ought to be prized, and worked for. We'd be better able to use some of our most valuable instincts, so beautifully explained by Angier in http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/23/health/psychology/23COOP.html if people accepted ideas simple enough to work as a rhyme for children -- ideas we already know.

Adults need secrets, lies and fictions
To live within their contradictions

......But when things go wrong
......And knock about

......Folks get together
......And work it out

"Missile defense" is a case in point. Assets deployed on the basis of incorrect financial or technical accounting should be redeployed in ways that can be productive. If that were well done, just about everyone would be better off, and safer.

I've asked that a number of things be checked. Some important to my survival - to my ability to live a normal life. It seems to me that everybody honest involved would be better off personally -- and the country would be better off, in ways that matter a lot, if the checking were done, on this and similar issues, rather than evaded.

And checking is a lot more likely, on a lot of things, than it was just weeks ago. That's reason for average valuations to go up some, I believe.

lchic - 12:46pm Jul 25, 2002 EST (#3302 of 3327)

It may be this cartoon posting that got his boss on the batphone

A comment from the Prez on this please
http://www.drparsons.fsnet.co.uk/georg.html
Exactly!

lchic - 05:53pm Jul 25, 2002 EST (#3303 of 3327)

I read this http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/23/health/psychology/23COOP.html?pagewanted=all&position=top and in the this goes with that sense
http://www.msnbc.com/news/784052.asp would have to be set by it
see cantabb "Science News Poetry" 7/23/02 12:53am and next SciPoem lchic "Science News Poetry" 7/23/02 7:14am ... along with which one would have to take into account that many 'standard beliefs' including dominant male are being reworked, as in the getting through the gate {GameTheory - direct v side}subway station research.

If the old theories are where the rules and political systems were devised - and they misfit the community they are supposed to provide for - then a re-think is important. If co-operatively the people in the system can be happier, healthier, safer and more productive - then the overall outcome scores higher.

The USA should look at it's competitive self - the Guardian Washington Correspondent saw the US as being too violent and too competitive. Saw people at the lower end of the social scale not getting the quality of attention for service required ... and the rest (who declare themselves to be God-Loving Church goers) didn't see the problem.

Wonder how many 'done over' by the falling value of their pension investments and theft might now re-evalute their attitude to co-operative fair provision.

(24 following messages)

New York Times on the Web Forums Science Missile Defense